Wednesday, February 17, 2016

If At First You Don't Succeed...Try Again And Piss Off EVERYONE

Well now...Okay then...I guess the Fluoride Four have a new ally (or two) over in the County Courthouse. Below is the text of an email that County Commissioner Mike Chapman apparently sent to Jim Jones sometime in the last day or so. How's this sit with you if it's legit?

I forgot to ask you earlier today to please make sure the Health Dept schedules a work session with the proper public notice if they plan to ask the Commissioners to proceed with mandating fluoride Countywide. If the Health Dept doesn't need the BOCC approval then please have them schedule the necessary public hearings before moving forward.

Also at some point we will need the Prosecutor's Office to advise, if the Health Dept wants to move forward, as to the authority and legality of countywide fluoridation.



  1. Actually here is the email I sent to a constituent earlier today.
    "Just so you know I cast the lone "NO" vote. I figure the Health Dept will soon ask the Commissioners to mandate fluoride in those water systems the County oversees. The resolution was pretty broad based. The sad part in all this is that the resolution was not on the Board of Health agenda and we only had a handful of people who were somehow made aware the Board would be voting on the resolution. So much for open government and public process.
    > Not much else to say...I'm pretty frustrated about it all.
    > Mike"

    I am concerned the Board of Health will try to force flouridation countywide and I sent an email making sure they follow the public process if they do. Let me be clear I am NOT calling for public hearings nor do I support countywide flouridation. I apologize for the confusion.
    Commissioner Mike Chapman

    1. For the record, from my perspective, it seems clear the above email is responding to an idea that has been put forward, not initiating an idea to move forward. It's calling for the public part of the process to take place. A careful reading of the message shouldn't result in any confusion.

      But I am deeply curious about the non-public part of this process. Who is pushing SO HARD on the fluoride issue? And why? And, of course, why NOW? It's the worst possible time for something like this to be proposed.

    2. It could also be taken that you laid out the blueprint for HOW to get this done...

    3. Hi Mike,

      I don't think it is confusing, at all. This is being pushed by a few people, and the Clallam Board of Health made a really, really bad decision they didn't have to make.

      I want to thank you for calling attention to this fiasco, for being the lone "NO" vote, and for standing up for the rest of us.

      We all better hope this dies a quiet death. If the BoH tries to move forward with this, they will face such a fierce response from county residents!

      They will need auditoriums, and many days to get through the public hearings on this!

  2. This is legit.

    Can you imagine the mayhem if they try to go forward with this?

    From the comments of those that attended yesterdays meeting, they are contemplating requiring private well owners to fluoridate their own water!

    The whole area is going nutty!

    1. @9:14, I assume you meant by your comment that this situation is serious, but as to "legit", well, as a matter of law that resolution is NOT at all legitimate in the manner in which it was produced. Plus it contains blatant misrepresentations of fact (e.g. "every major health organization supports fluoridation..."), and each such material misrepresentation in a public document is unlawful. The fluoride-pushers have absolutely no credibility.

    2. @Anon 8:52

      "legit" was in response to what appeared to be a question about the authenticity of the note CK posted. Having seen the original, I know it was for real, not a hoax.

      As you can tell by the content of the rest of the post, I agree with you, they have no credibility, they've gone "nutty".

  3. This should be on the Chamber of Commerce welcome sign to Port Angeles:
    "Port Angeles, where City Hall does what they want and it's legal to brand your kid" How's that for a PR campaign.

  4. Thanks for this vital info, CK. It's pretty amazing. This really makes the whole big "fluoride committee" article in the PDN this morning totally irrelevant. Obviously plans have been hatched behind the scenes. Thanks again for helping to peel the veil back. That's something the PDN will never do.

    1. Thanks for the kind words. And yes, it seems pretty clear now why the Fluoride Four reined in their behavior. It is hard to believe they didn't know this was in the works, which makes them all, at best, incredibly disingenuous. At worst, which is closer to the truth, I suspect, they are just liars and manipulators.

      If they see a County move as some sort of trump card, they are misinformed. Yes, a stick of dynamite trumps a firecracker - but only because it explodes even more violently.

    2. This is insanity! Who the hell thought this was a good approach to take?

    3. Commissioner Peach and County Administrator Jim Jones (along with a third man in a dark suit I didn't recognize) were seen going into Port Angeles City Hall around 5:30, just before the last council meeting. They lefy about 15 minutes later.

  5. From a posting in PDN comments section:
    Kidd: stating she wanted democracy and to hear from the public last summer after authorizing survey prior to her election. After she was elected only listens to medical officials that fit with her decision to go against what majority of survey wanted.
    Clallam Public Eye:

    Gase: statement regarding fluoride last summer: Aug 9, 2015 "Dan Gase said they would vote to stop fluoridating city water if that's what water users say they want in the survey, which will be conducted by mail on a still-undesignated date in November". -Peninsula Daily News Aug 9, 2015

    Survey wasted over 10K. Can these two of the four council that voted against the will of the people - refund the city $2500 for their part in paying for a survey they would just ignore anyway. It would be "Best Practices" to show goodwill toward being fiscally responsible.

  6. Under what legal authority can a county Board of Health mandate the addition of chemicals to all domestic water supplies? It must come as news to the Clallam PUD & Dry Creek Water Association, for example, that they can be ordered-around by county officials like this.
    Yeesh! Revolting!!!

  7. The fix is in. Democrats take note: Norma Turner and Mark Ozias, the new democrat on the county commission, brought this to the table. Remember your state representatives, Tharinger and Van de Wege, who brought you Mark Ozias, both wrote an opinion piece in the daily paper in support of continued fluoridation for Port Angeles. Both these representatives received the maximum allowed contributions from the Delta Dental Association--the group that first brought fluoride to Port Angeles. Interestingly Ozias was at the Board of Health meeting but slipped out of the room just prior to the vote on recommending fluoridation for all county water water.
    This is a good time for county residents to see what they have in common with those fighting fluoride in Port Angeles. If you thought this was just a Port Angeles problem it is now squarely on your plate county residents.
    Residents need to press Ozias asking him how he would have voted had not such urgent business drawn him away from the Board of Health meeting just prior to the vote. BTW, it is easy to vote "no" when you are certain you have sufficient yes votes to pass the measure.

    1. You might also ask him what "business" drew him away in the first place, what with him now being a full-time paid County Commissioner. Sure seems like it was his "business" to stay and state his position. As is, it sounds a little suspicious.

    2. I am astounded that the medical/dental providers in Port Angeles and their political friends are making such a huge effort to force water fluoridation onto an unwilling public.
      Could it be that their fragile egos are threatened by the segment of the populace that refuses to bow down to them and their recommendations on this issue?
      Is it so terrible for ordinary people to think for themselves about what they want in their water supply, rather than blindly following the dictates of the community's "medical elite"?

    3. If you could really, really get Mark Ozias in a corner, and in a chatty mood, you could also ask him what, if anything, Steve Tharinger and Kevin Van De Wege have said to him about the fluoride issue.

      How about it Commissioner Ozias? Is there anything you'd like to tell your constituents?

    4. With a bit of truth serum Ozias would have to tell you his handlers, Tharinger and Van de Wege both received the maximum donations allowed from the Delta Dental Foundation, the ones who first brought fluoride to Port Angeles. Both Tharinger and Van de Wege wrote letters to the paper supporting fluoridation. They put him in office how do you think he would vote? That is why Ozias ran out of the meeting just before the vote by the Board of Health. He left his constituents unrepresented at a critical moment in time. This is leadership???

    5. Mr. Ozias, I have some questions for you. Please email me at your convenience.

      Thank you.

  8. Why does it seem like a majority of our elected officials, and the staff under their direction, are declaring war on the citizens they are supposed to serve? Clearly, none of them are trying to de-escalate the conflict, they're just sending more fighters in. It really is crazy and disheartening.

    1. Well said. Agreed. Why are they escalating the battle? Disheartening indeed.

  9. I guess I will have to take my family to Sequim to eat in restaurants and buy my organic foods, as Port Angeles is really not the place to drink healthy water!

  10. I live in a house with a private well and I'll be damned if some government bureaucrat is going tell me to poison my own water supply. -Port Angeles Citizen

  11. It sure seems like this is really about something other than fluoride.

    It sure seems to me like someone, or some group, has an agenda to push, and fluoride is either a cover for it, or a distraction from it.

    Because, as stupid as they may be, even I have a hard time believing that the people at the county would be SO stupid as to push this right now.

    So I'm left to wonder what is REALLY going on. What is the REAL motivation behind this? To break the spirit of the community? To split it in two? Why?

    Why now? And just plain why?

    1. This is the last gasp of the old guard attempting to hold on to power in the face of progress. They are getting desperate and making foolish choices.

    2. But again...How does fluoridating the water supply get anyone "power," other than the power to fluoridate the water supply? I don't see the cause and effect.

      Pushing fluoride is the effect. But money is the cause. There almost certainly is money behind this, but the details aren't clear, at least not to me. Yes, I know the dental association people have donated money to local politicians, but again...WHO IS MAKING MONEY OFF OF THIS? Said dental association would have made $400,000 if the City of Port Angele shad STOPPED fluoridating early. If they wanted money, that would have been a nice chunk. But do they actually make money themselves from the City using it?

    3. these people put a ton of work into following the money of Delta Dental:

      Check out the MONEY that Delta Dental has at its ready in WA: Revenue:
      $1,094,464,428 as of 2014/12
      Income: $1,183,658,273 as of 2014/12
      Assets: $237,972,879 as of 2014/12
      Accounting Year End: 2014/12


      Seems to me that dentists, locally, should look at what dentists all over the country are doing..stepping away from the ADA and insurance, because these groups are dictating way more than they should be.

      This is a really good article:

    4. Cherie is quoted in this ADA newsletter about Port Angeles...

    5. Thanks for the great links and information! But gee, I wonder why the ADA article doesn't mention the huge $400,000 penalty that was built into the prior agreement with Port Angeles. A budget-busting, punitive penalty like that doesn't seem friendly, healthy, or even like something that should be legal, frankly. It's the City's decision, so why was this deal crafted so it could benefit the dental association?

      Think about it: If say, historically, when the City bought vehicles, they generally bought Fords, does it stand to reason that Ford could get a penalty if the City bought from another automaker? That sounds crazy to me. It's a local government decision. Yet there it was, a $400,000 penalty built into a measure that was (purportedly) about protecting public health.

      Yeah, right. Protect it, OR ELSE.

  12. The following was posted on the Port o Call website. I was blown away when I read it, and realized that The Chamber, PABA, PADA, County Aire, lots of businesses in town, and each city council member really needs to see this:

    "Letter to the editor,
    I’ve been following the fluoride issue for quite some time now and find myself thankful I am not being subjected to consuming fluoride against my will as I live outside city limits.

    With that in mind, several months ago I was shopping in Port Angeles at a local supermarket. While selecting some greens in the produce section I heard the faint crackling of thunder, a precursor to the automatic watering system activating, warning consumers to step back to avoid getting wet.

    While the water was misting the vegetables it dawned on me, “that’s not just water, that’s Port Angeles’ fluoridated water”!

    I already altered my restaurant habits by intentionally avoiding eating within Port Angeles city limits for the sole purpose of avoiding the unnecessary consumption of added chemicals to my “diet”.

    Since I had just started my grocery shopping I left the store and drove to the Sequim location where I have also taken my restaurant business as well.

    I spend approximately $3,000 annually on supplements and probably $20,000 on consumables, including eating out.

    One major drawback is I miss the owners and workers from the locations I used to frequent in P.A. but find similar graciousness and hospitality in neighboring Sequim and, besides, I enjoy the drive!

    Maybe it’s time for the Port Angeles Business Association, Port Angeles Downtown Association, Chamber of Commerce and other business groups to voice their concerns to your city council regarding the fluoride issue.

    Although my pro-active approach might not be the norm it certainly makes me feel better about what’s going into my body.

    Richard Ward"

    My suggestion is that everyone who cares about this town, cut and paste this Letter into a note to as many of the above mentioned people and groups you have the time for. This is far more serious than the BoH resolution (although that has to be dealt with, too). Port Angeles cannot afford it's own residents boycotting local businesses because of what Cherie Kidd and the others are trying to do.

    Google will easily give you email addresses for the above people and groups.

    And, it isn't just this one letter.

    1. Shouldn't Country Aire be spearheading the anti-fluoridation issue?

      Has anyone spoken to that General Manager or the Produce Manager about this?

    2. Yes, and they say they don't want to get involved.

      Remember, Josh is the son-in-law of a well established member of the powers-that-be in Port Angeles. What do you expect?

      Well, I'll tell you what I expect. The businesses cannot have it both ways. They cannot be members of our community, expect our support, and not support us.

      Now is the time to be counted, businesses in Port Angeles. Either you stand up and help us, or we will help consumers have a choice where they spend their money.

    3. I shop at Sunny Farms. The co-op in Port Townsend is also really very nice.

    4. It's useless talking to Josh, the GM of Country Air. As Anon 9:29 PM said, he's a junior member of the power structure so he'll do his best to maintain the status quo.

      The owners of Country Air just want your money, plain and simple, and they don't care about the community.

      Country Air has a high turn over of employees. Given the attitude of the owners and the management, it's gotta be a swell place to work.

    5. Josh is a young member of the "old guard" and will not attempt to do anything that would anger his daddy in law. When his business shrinks a few points he will have to make a stand or turn out the lights.

    6. I'd say "turn out the lights" would be his best bet!

    7. I say, if "business" in Port Angeles wants all our tax money, help, freebies and , most importantly, our support and patronage, they really better get a clue, and step up.

      Remember Port Angeles businesses, the customer is always right.

      If any of the businesses in town think the talk of their needing to take a stand are meaningless "threats", they do so at their own peril. Once consumers change their shopping habits, and find a better experience, they rarely return to their previous shopping places.

    8. The owners of Country Aire are business people first, greedy people second, and then, way, way, way down the list, health-oriented community members. Groovy hippies they are not.

    9. Many of you are aware that Country Aire is for sale. Rumor has it that Daddy-In-Law Haguewood plans to buy the store for Josh, let him run it until it collapses (those of you in PADA are all too aware of Josh's endearing, warm personality) and then use the empty property as a huge tax write-off until they unload it onto some other sucker.

    10. Anon 8:48 AM: I've heard the same thing - biz for sale - but I can't find any listings to prove it. Got any further details/links to help?

    11. My understanding is that this sale is being conducted privately. Further, my sources have told me that they initially approached three natural food chains and were turned down by all three.

      The owners bit off more than they could chew with that beast of a store, burned down their regular customers, hired Mr. Corporate Big Box Store to (mis)manage the place and now want out but pronto!

    12. Interesting. Who are your sources?

  13. Here is another posted at PoC:

    "It looks like I too will need to do my dining and shopping in Sequim, as I can’t avoid the medicated (fluoridated) water in Port Angeles. Even the “organic foods” are mislabeled in Port Angeles!

    The voice of the “vocal majority” is being ignored by the benevolent dictators of our city council, who are treating their voter constituency as mere children unable to decide for ourselves how we should live and what’s best for ourselves.

    It’s a fact that we all must drink water to live. This access to clean water is a God-given right of every citizen. It is also a fact that we do not need fluoride to live.

    It seems that to remove fluoride from our water, we must first remove our city council members who voted against the will of the majority of the people!"

    1. Yep! I have run into so many people in just the last day or so that are really pissed off at what the city council is doing. People who are not into politics at all, but have read about that the council has been doing. They all said they will do all their shopping in Sequim from now on.

      Hey! Way to go, City of Port Angeles.

  14. KONP's website now has a story about this, and it's pretty sleazy. The fluoride issue wasn't on the agenda; it was added "at the last minute." The board of health is made up (primarily) of the three county commissioners, but Mark Ozias sleazed out before the vote was taken. It all stinks. And not a word of it yet in the PDN. Thanks to this blog for bringing this forward so quickly.

    1. "Last minute" additions aren't even necessarily legal, so...Why all the secrecy Board of Health members? If you're doing something that's so good for people, why are you behaving like you're doing something BAD? Shame? Cowardice? What?

    2. The "last minute addition" was all typed up by somebody and ready to go for the 7 members of the Board of Health to read and approve. Who wrote it?
      BTW - It is posted on the Clallam County website for the Board of Health. It is Resolution #1 of 2016.

    3. Nothing in the Open Public Meetings Act prohibits changes to an agenda after its publication. That also tends to gut one of the Kidd ethics charges. RCW 42.30.077.

    4. So, Anon 6:35 PM, you don't see anything at all deceptive or sleazy about that? You don't see any avoidance behavior?

      Or, to put it another way, do you see a real good faith effort to engage in open government?


    5. It's entirely possible Anon 6:35PM is trying to bait someone to "tip" their argument into the open about Open Meetings & other violations, so that the evil side can better cover their tracks.
      I don't like to think they are that smart, but it's the real "pushers" of this that I'm afraid have some smart propaganda artists.

    6. Just because you possess an atom bomb, doesn't mean you have to use it.

      The laws may allow changes, but given what is going on in the community, was it the wise thing to do?

    7. It is correct that nothing prohibits adding an item at the last minute but it is not something that should be used to be deceptive. That's what makes this sleazy. Emergencies come up - say there's a road washout and an emergency declaration has to be made in order to proceed with repairs - that's the kind of valid reason why a last minute thing would be added. But it is very much frowned upon to sneak something in - that was no emergency - it certainly could have waited and been properly publicly noticed.

  15. Mark Ozias better start talking, and he better have the right things to say. This sure does not look good.

    And I had hopes things were going to be different. Silly me.

    1. Ozias is on record as supporting the resolution to fluoridate the entire county water supply.

    2. Mark Ozias raised a total of $32,830 and spent $31,362.41. 6500 was from the local Democrats. His opponent spend 23,866.19
      Gee, wonder why he isn't speaking up for "the people". And, this is what is wrong with our government.

    3. Wow...Not even in office for six months, and Mark Ozias is already acting like a sleazy Clallam County politician, and selling his constituents down the (fluoridated) river.

      That didn't take long.

    4. That really is too bad.

      I was going to ask "Is there something in the water, or what?" Then I remembered, there is.

      I know, he doesn't live in Port Angeles. He just is beholden to the "Local Democrats", the group of few elitists who sit behind the scenes and play politics. And we get what we got. Crap. Crap. And ongoing crap.

  16. Folks, I would like to "officially" announce that I will not be seeking re-election this year.

    My decision is final even with lots of people asking me to reconsider.
    Since this fall's election will determine which political party has control of the Board of Commissioners for at least 2 years I want to reiterate my decision now so both parties can recruit top tier candidates. This will also be the first commissioner election decided only by District voters per the County Charter change last year and that adds a dynamic we haven't seen before.

    Representing District 2 on the Board of Commissioners has been the honor of a lifetime! Thank you.
    Mike Chapman

  17. Another meeting to attend en masse.
    Board of Health meetings are usually held at 1:30 PM the 3rd Tuesday of every month, in the Commissioner´s Board Room #160 on the main floor of the Clallam County Courthouse at 223 East 4th Street. All Board of Health meetings are open to the public.

    Here's the thing--if the final approval by the County Commission fails then how will the PA city council justify continuing fluoridation in city water against the wishes of the majority?.In other words,if it isn't approved by the County then it makes PA City Council look like bullies!..and if the ordinance passes then the entire population of county residents will be fighting this battle and I'd bet a bundle that there are even more anti-fluoride residents outside Port Angeles-throughout Clallam- than in this city. It's a no win situation for fluoridation!

  18. There's a new update on a pending public records request back on the topic, "A Picture is Worth a Thousand Words." Just so you know.

  19. Speaking of updates, all 100 signs have now been asked for by residents, and sent out. After the last council meeting, there was a great surge in requests for the signs, and a couple hundred more are on their way to Port Angeles.

    Laura O'Neal, whose name was all over those full color placards that were mailed to everyone last Fall, and who was named along with Ed Chadd and Norma Turner in the petitions and phone surveys to support the Four, was eyeing the signs with a nasty glare at the last council meeting.

    It is likely she and the lobbyists behind the pro-fluoride activities we've been witnessing of late are contemplating a sign campaign supporting the Four, to counter the "Step Down" effort. If so, this will follow what has to be one of the biggest political blunders in Clallam county in recent memory, the BoH resolution effort by the same folks!

    Talk about the worst possible timing. The same day the "First Time Ever" Ethics Violation process against Deputy Mayor Cherie Kidd is formally undertaken? And, to show the public of Port Angeles she cares about them, ethics, and the integrity of the seat she holds, she laughs her way through the meeting ?!

    Bring it on. Demonstrate for all to see. Validate further what the former mayors said that the current council has created:"complete chaos".

    1. Ham-handed doesn't even begin to describe the way they're handling this.

    2. You mean Laura O'Neal the "advice lady"

      "Laura O’Neal has been a trainer for over 25 years teaching communications, business start-up, non-profit Board/Staff training and many basic and advanced mediation and conflict resolution subjects. Laura has been a certified mediator for 15 years mediating family, business, and victim/offender cases."

      She doesn't seem like much of a "mediator" to me.

      She also considers herself to be a wit and comedian. In 2008, she had a one-woman show: Laura O'Neal presents "Travels of a Broad," and in 2014, she performed "Not Your Mama's Menopause", according to the PDN: PA funny lady makes menopause something for everyone to laugh. (yuck)

      Clearly the woman has displayed no humor at the council meetings, and mostly just glares.

    3. I seem to recall that Laura O'Neal works/worked for Steve Tharinger as a legislative aide? Or maybe just on his campaign staff?

  20. It is something to behold. I think there is a lot to be learned and understood from what is going on right now, in Port Angeles.

    Anybody in the whole world can watch the video of Cherie Kidd banging her gavel at the meeting two weeks or so ago. It isn't ancient history. If I had done something that was so wrong, I would cringe from embarrassment. I would find every way possible to apologize, and explain.

    We see this happening with Mike Chapman, who is all over every site explaining, clarifying, responding and apologizing for misunderstandings. Cherie Kidd makes no such effort.

    The rest of the Four make no such efforts.

    The PDN doubles down, and buries any mention. Sure, the former mayors call what the current council has created as "complete chaos", and now two council members have Ethics Violations charges filed, first time ever. But, the daily paper just minimizes the turmoil the city is in, with it's clear allegiance to "The powers-that-be". The people don't really need to know.

    At one meeting I attended a week or so ago, a food server who works at one of our local establishments got up to say that they are asked frequently whether the water served contains fluoride.

    At one of the local supermarkets two days ago, the council meeting fiasco came up with one of the managers. As we talked, am employee joined us, to talk about store affairs. As they waited to interject they concerns, they heard our conversation. Immediately, they said "Our filtered water bottle filling station is very popular. People tell me all the time they are concerned about what the city does to the water". And they followed with, " I won't drink city water because of the fluoride".

    Cherie Kidd and the others may see this as some kind of benevolent dictatorship, where she (and they) can try to silence people who don't like what she (they) do, but the truth is, it isn't. They may not want to hear or acknowledge that their decisions are the reason this town remains stagnant and poor while surrounding communities prosper, but the truth is, they ARE responsible.

    Cherie Kidd may think this is some kind of ego game where she (and the others) can put on a brave smile, and ignore the complaints against her, but the truth is, she only embarrasses herself.

    She thinks smiling as if nothing wrong has transpired is the proper response, but any rational and moral person knows otherwise.

    She is an embarrassment to herself, and as a representative of the City.

    1. Excellent comments, and very on the mark!

    2. Another complaint?

    3. 11:08AM: "and now two council members have Ethics Violations charges filed, first time ever." I thought Smith's complaint was only against Kidd?

    4. Oh, THAT second complaint.

      Marolee's was better, and stronger. But the more the merrier at this point. They've brought this on themselves.

  21. My complaint WAS only about Kidd.

    There was a second ethics complaint filed, by someone else, for Kidd and Gase. (I had nothing to do with that one.)

    Step too can file an ethics complaint.

  22. How about filing an ethics complaint against Kidd and the manner in which she handled the Lodging Tax funds LAST YEAR.
    She chaired the lodging tax give-away committee and allowed Scott Nagel to sit in on the proceedings after receiving two emails from city staff explaining to her Nagel has a conflict and should not be sitting on the discussions. Nagel proceeded to sit in on the meetings steer grants and then excused himself from the vote. He got his $10,000 and made sure only those Kidd endorsed got their grants.

  23. There are many, many things that should get ethics complained about. However, unless it is done in a timely manner, then it could be dismissed. Not that there is a statute of limitations -- yet.

    The ethics complaint is only good for one thing: to get Cherie to not be deputy mayor, and to throw some mud on her stockings.

    That is about it.

    But, her response? She will ignore the "message" that is being conveyed. "All is well" "she isn't worried". This is not NORMAL. Nor are her increasingly strange actions.

    (In fact, there are a few seats in the council chambers where the acoustics are just right -- with her in her new seat -- that you can hear her mumble and hum to herself when people are speaking at the podium.)

    The truth is Cherie Kidd has **lost it** (contrary to the people who think she never actually HAD IT).

    If you review tapes, even from a year ago, this is becoming more and more obvious. If you listen to the audio recordings -- her speech patterns have changed.
    Review the tapes of her -- she's really exhibiting sings of dementia, and her patterns of speech are becoming strange, and more exaggerated.

    She has, several times, recently, said she was "confused" when other council members have been involved in a debate. She has said inappropriate things, in response to an ongoing debate. She has said strange things during public comment -- often not even related to what is being said.

    The worst of all: her reason for adding fluoride was one of the strangest, rambling, most incoherent "logic" I have ever heard (even from HER).

    And, her intense paranoia at the Feb 2 meeting was completely out of character. Sure, she's grating, but this was beyond normal "Cherie Kidd goofy".

    Early signs of dementia include:

    Ability to focus and pay attention
    Reasoning and judgment decreasing
    Challenges in planning or solving problems
    Angry outbursts, fearful, anxious
    Problems in speaking -- remembering the right words, trailing off without completing sentence, etc.

    So, the question becomes one of: can a council member be forced to step down if their illness is advancing to such a point that they cannot function? Has there been any precedent for this?

    Her decline is pretty obvious, folks. Go watch, and listen. I think we should all be very concerned.

    1. @11:23AM, "The ethics complaint is only good for one thing: to get Cherie to not be deputy mayor, and to throw some mud on her stockings. That is about it."

      I generally agree with you, but here I beg to differ. It has many important uses & effects.

      Not trying to pick at you, your observations about Kidd are very likely correct.
      BTW, is anyone here a psychiatrist? I think we need one to diagnose each of the F4.

  24. I can buy that Cherie is doty. (definition: weak-minded; especially : having the mentality impaired in old age)

    This is only going to get worse.